Let’s Save The Red House

Sometimes I get approached about whether or not I would post an article about certain topical, local issues. As my website mission statement is that this is a website “not only about the city of Chester, but for the people of Chester,” I like to think I will spread the word on relevant topics wherever I can and whenever I can. And, of course, if I think it is worthy of a mention. So, on that note, in the last couple of days I’ve been approached about writing a piece about “Let’s Save The Red House.” After a bit of digging around for information, it was soon apparent that it was well worth making a post about the topic.

Let’s Save The Red House

So, welcome to my “Let’s Save The Red House” post folks. Please read on and see what the debate is all about and maybe consider your own views on the subject. You can follow up to date news and information by checking out this Facebook Group – “Let’s Save The Red House” – HERE.

Initially, before having a bit of a dig around, my first reaction was, what about The Red House? To the best of my knowledge, The Red House as I remembered it, was no longer a pub. It ceased to be a pub some 14 years or so ago.

Nowadays, it is in fact an Italian restaurant called Et Alia. As I’ve never been to the restaurant I can’t really comment as to whether it is worth a visit or not. A quick look around Trip Advisor though will give you more help there.

But, as it stands, it’s status and standing as a restaurant is not the hot topic currently under debate. Being approached to consider writing an article on the debate was initially a bit of a mystery to me though. But, a quick rummage around the “Big G” and a couple of articles later and I’m more up to speed.

But before I go on to what “Let’s Save The Red House” is all about, let me take a quick trip down Memory Lane and recollect my own memories of The Red House – as a pub – in days gone by.

The Red House And My Trip Down Memory Lane

As I say, I’ve never been to Et Alia, so my memories are only of life before it ever became a restaurant. To keep it brief, my memories of The Red House was that it was a pub well worth visiting. A pub that was well loved by the local community, served good beer, spacious, family friendly, good food and generally ticked a lot of boxes as far as what people were looking for from a pub.

To be honest, not living in that Sandy Lane/Huntington/Dee Banks area, it wasn’t a regular haunt of mine, but I did go in there fairly often. And I did know some of the regulars. Hence one of my reasons to call in there now and then. Also, these regulars loved the place. Which, believe it or not, to many people, this means an awful lot. A point that seems to be lost along the way at times when new developments are being considered.

The pub had a steady, regular clientele and, largely because of it’s location, it also had a healthy passing trade. So, what of the location? If anyone is actually asking that question then they obviously haven’t been to The Red House. Or Et Alia for that matter. The pub’s location is, let’s say, the icing on the cake. Or, it’s crowning glory.

Spectacular Views

Sat high up on the banks of the River Dee, the views and the scenery are quite simply, stunning. Spectacular in fact. When I sent my first reply to the lady who approached me about writing this article, I mentioned that sitting outside in The Red House beer garden on a nice summer’s day, was like being on holiday. And it was. Reading more into the “Let’s Save The Red House” story, there are those who think that this should still be the case. Also, it should remain to be so for many years and generations to come.

Sitting outside with a good pint of beer, watching the world and the boats go by in front of the backdrop of The Meadows is something that everyone in Chester should experience.

In a nutshell, those are my brief recollections of The Red House. So why the “Let’s Save The Red House” campaign today? Read on for more information. And, at the same time, take a moment to consider your own views on this.

Let’s Save The Red House

Feeding off news found on Google, I discover that earlier this month it was reported that plans have been submitted to demolish The Red House and in its place build seven new, luxury apartments. The “luxury” description isn’t mine by the way. These proposed new dwellings were described as luxury in this article HERE in the local newspaper, The Chester Standard.

The full planning application was submitted to the Council by a Lancashire based property company. Now, I haven’t seen any details of the application other than what I’ve found on Google.

The reasons for selling Et Alia in the first place are not known to me either. However, in this particular instance, it’s not really relevant either as, going forward, the aim of the community, as an alternative idea to the apartments development, isn’t centred on it being a restaurant. More on these ideas below.

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An Historic 170 Year Old Community Asset

As the Chester Standard article says, the planning application came as a shock to the local community. And as a result, the local community are not happy with the idea that a 170 year old community asset may well be turned into even more luxury accommodation that, to some people, are not necessary.

And not only “some people.” Do the Council themselves see the need for seven new, luxury apartments? Maybe not. Or, if they do, no doubt they will explain. That might be interesting.

The Proposed New Development In A Bit More Detail

In another post I saw a description of the proposed seven dwelling development. Without going into too much detail, the idea is for two, four-bedroom; four, three-bedroom and one two-bedroom apartments to be built. The description in the article also went on to mention other features which, in all honesty sounded more like a sales pitch rather than something for a local community to get excited about.

Quite clearly, the local community do not want a luxury apartment complex to replace an historic, well established, attractive piece of Chester heritage. And if the reason to sell Et Alia was partly because of a lack of customers, then having an Italian restaurant is not a huge appeal to local residents either.

What is of huge interest though is to revert the existing site back to it becoming a pub again. But not just any pub. It can be described as a pub with a difference I suppose. The aim is to register the pub as an “Asset of Community Value.”

It is my understanding that an application to register the site as an “Asset of Community Value (ACV)” has been submitted and acknowledged by the Council. Basically, that means the Council now has 8 weeks to decide on this application. Therefore, a decision should be made by the Council on, or by, 17th May.

That being the case, I would imagine that there will not be any decision on the planning application until the ACV application has been considered. To put a bit more meat on the bones though, some readers may be asking, what is an “Asset of Community Value?”

What Is An Asset Of Community Value?

In short, ” In England, an Asset of Community Value (ACV) is land or property of importance to a local community which is subject to additional protection from development under the Localism Act 2011.”

Or, alternatively……..

“A building or other land is an asset of community value if its main use has recently been or is presently used to further the social wellbeing or social interests of the local community and could do so in the future.”

Note the bolded out bits.

If an application is successful, a local community then has the opportunity to identify assets of community value, have them listed and, when they are put up for sale, there is more time available to raise finance and bid for them.

Listed Assets

At the stage when a listed asset is to be sold, local community groups have an opportunity to buy the asset at market value and protect its community value.

With a status of listed, an asset remains protected for five years. At the end of the five year period a local group can apply to have the asset listed again.

An owner of an asset which is listed has the right to request a review of the decision to list it and the asset remains listed during the review period.

What Happens After An Asset Is Listed?

Once an asset has been listed nothing happens unless the owner decides to sell it. If and when they decide to sell, the owner has to notify the local authority of its intentions and the local authority informs the community group of this.

The community group can then request that they are to be treated as a potential bidder and ask for a six month postponement period in which to negotiate a sale with the owner. That doesn’t mean that the asset will be sold to the community group however.

Ultimately, the owner of the asset does not have to sell to a community group however. At the end of the suspended period they can sell to whoever they want and whatever price they want.

However, what if the asset has already been sold and a planning application has been submitted? Then hasn’t the process already commenced some way down the road towards an apartment construction? Will the community still have time to have their plans and ideas heard, and even more significantly, acted on? I believe there are ways in which processes and procedures will fall into a better alignment even with the planning application already submitted.

For instance and to clarify further, I’m assuming that if the Council have allowed the ACV application to be made, everything is still in the melting pot so to speak. And as it is the Council who hold the key to the future of this historic landmark, then the submission of this application is vital.

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What Comes First – The Chicken Or The Egg?

If everything is still in the melting pot as far as the Council are concerned, then isn’t it a case of what comes first? The chicken or the egg? Or, more specifically, if a decision in support of the ACV application is made, then surely that will mean, the property on the land cannot be demolished? Irrespective of the planning application.

A way around that would be if the asset owner appealed against a listed asset decision. Mind you, that doesn’t mean to say an appeal will be successful. And in the meantime, the property cannot be demolished anyway during the appeal process.

But what if an ACV application is rejected? I would imagine the same right of appeal would come into play?

But if a planning application decision is made in favour of the development then doesn’t that negate the ACV application? Also, not so in this instance as an appeal could be made against the successful planning application decision.

All of which, when you think about it, provides the local resident committee with an opportunity to buy more time if need be. Valuable time maybe whereby they can firm up on their plans they have for the community venue.

In which case, it may not matter what actually comes first. In either the chicken or the egg case, appeals are possible. And, I would have thought, the longer the delay, the better the opportunity for the community to engage more support and fine tune plans.

So, as far as the Council are concerned then, what are the considerations?

The Case For Option (a)

The case for option (a) is that planning permission is granted. And if that is to happen, what the community have to look forward to (after the disruption of the building work) is that a former, historic landmark site will consist of the seven dwellings as per above.

In addition though (as per the sales pitch), there will be these features. “All apartments will benefit from a private terrace, garden or balcony overlooking the river, with the remainder of the site landscaped to form communal grounds. The existing pontoon on the river will be retained.”

The scores on the doors at this stage is that there may be (if the properties are all sold) in the region of 22 happy new residents. But how many unhappy, existing residents?

Will there be any new facilities and amenities added to the community with the proposed new development? Will there be any new facilities added to the community if the ACV proposals come to fruition? See below for more details of the ACV proposals.

What about some other aspects for the local community to consider if the apartment development goes ahead? There may well be a possible/probable increase in Council Tax. More bins to empty, more street lighting; potentially more policing etc.

No doubt the Council will consider these important points, amongst others, before deciding whether to grant the planning application.

On the other hand, let’s consider Option (b).

The Case For Option (b)

Reading the Chester Standard article (link above), the local community have rallied and have really put their thinking caps on it seems. As an ACV, many ideas have been put together. Carry on reading to see if you think the local residents ideas for The Red House are community spirited or not. In other words, do the ideas fit into the overall benefit of the whole community?

Let’s Save The Red House – The Community’s Ideas

After reading the article, I must say the brief outline looks good. The work and the thinking behind the local residents suggestions is quite impressive actually. Let’s take a look at these suggestions in a bit more detail.

a/ The local residents are hoping that The Red House can be returned to being a pub. A pub, let’s not forget, that was much loved and supported by residents in and around the Great Boughton area some 14 years ago and beyond.

b/ Local residents, under the guidance of local property owner and business woman, Kate Cousens, have come together to develop a business plan.

c/ The aim of which is to establish a family-friendly, dog-friendly community café/pub/restaurant that people will enjoy walking to from all areas of Great Boughton, Saighton Camp, Caldy Valley and beyond.

And what about the “and beyond” group? I live in Hoole, but ask me the question of whether I would visit the “new” Red House venture? The answer…….most definitely I would.

Anyway, carry on reading to see even more of the local residents suggestions.

d/ Another proposal is that The Red House would be used as a community library and/or book-swap.

e/ A prescription collection point.

f/ What about, a dementia café for Age Concern.

g/ This one is brilliant (as are all the others by the way), a community rowing boat / pedalo hire for children/adults.

My Tuppence Worth If I May?

If I may, can I expand on the boat theme slightly as well. What about, (in time) liaising with the local river cruise business, The Boat Company, and have The Red House as a stop off point for pick ups? If you haven’t been on one of their 2 hour boat cruises, you really must. Interesting, informative and educational to put it in a nutshell.

A great nature and local history trip for everyone. Especially local schools. Can anyone else see this immediate local community expanding way beyond it’s initial boundaries?

And of course, on the way back, it could be a drop off point. More potential custom for The Red House.

Anyway, I digress.

Let’s Save The Red House – Even More Ideas

h/ A music/entertainment/quiz venue.

Sorry, I can’t help mentioning another local opportunity possibility. Now, I’m a big fan of popping down to The Groves. As such, I’ve written quite a few articles on The Groves. In some of the articles I’ve also added a video I’ve made from such visits to The Groves.

More specifically, videos with local band, JakLash Cat in them. Never heard of them? Have a look at this link HERE to see one of my “The Groves” posts and watch the video and have a listen to JakLash Cat.

Topical Local Quiz

As far as quiz ideas are concerned, there are plenty of course. Quizzes like your normal pop or general quizzes for instance. But what about, a local history, nature type quiz after disembarking from an informative boat trip?

Just a couple of throwaway thoughts. And, of course, when it comes to music, not just limited to that one particular, local band. There are so many others. The point being, the idea itself of a music/entertainment/quiz venue, in my humble opinion, is a winner.

Let’s Save The Red House – And There’s More

(i) What about using it as a co-working meeting space.

Again, I love this idea. For instance, an ideal venue for say, work at home, individuals. You could have, as one idea of many, one day a week, pop to The Red House for a change from your normal, home venue. Enjoy a coffee or two (and a few biccies of course) and work in a different, very enjoyable environment. While, at the same time, meeting like minded, work from home people.

Only a throwaway thought again though. But you get the gist. There are many opportunities popping into mind for both the immediate and the surrounding communities.

(j) Or, what about, a venue suitable for hosting summer parties, local school events and commemorative occasions.

(k) The potential for a water-taxi service from The Red House site along the River Dee to The Groves (and the reverse trip as well of course) has also been explored. This, of course, will also be a way of easing road traffic congestion. Not to mention the ecological benefits as well.

I must admit, when I read this idea, I was (in my head) on my feet applauding. “Author, Author!!”…….etc….etc.

No doubt more ideas will come to mind. Hang on, I’ve just thought of another. What about an Amazon pick up centre?

Option (b) Summary

OK, how many “Wow” moments in those opportunities? As I said, I don’t even live in the immediate area and I’m well excited!!! Hats off to all those on the local resident committee for coming up with those ideas.

And I would imagine, this would only be scratching the surface. As the saying goes, “the world’s your lobster!!!”

However, am I excited at the thought of another landmark pub being closed by the Council and replaced by more luxury dwellings? No, not at all.

In the Chester Standard article, local MP, Chris Matheson has suggested that the ideas from the local residents are “well worth listening to.”

Well worth listening to!!! I should Cocoa!!!

One part of Chris Matheson’s comments I don’t agree with however is his comment of, “she (Kate Cousens) makes a very strong case for a community facility to provide a whole range of services and amenities in that part of town.”

Only a slight disagreement in that I think it goes way beyond “in that part of town” only. Maybe the venue would be in “that part of town” but the benefits would go beyond in my opinion. Just my tuppence worth.

Something else not mentioned of course, is the possibility of a few jobs being created.

Have a read again of the points above. Opportunities aplenty in the form of recreational, educational, cultural and sporting activities while not forgetting the job creation opportunity as well.

There are community organisations already in existence in neighbouring Huntington – e.g. Huntington Village Hall in Butterbache Road, so I’m guessing there could may well possibly be some sort of link up between the two? Enhancing the benefits to the local communities even further.

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Over To CWAC

One other thing that Mr Matheson also said, “the final decision on the future of The Red House rested with CWaC.”

So, what about the choice between Option (a) and Option (b) from the local council’s perspective?

Let’s Save The Red House – From CWAC’s Perspective

You may have noticed above that I did dwell on the word luxury a few times. Why would that be? Well, the reason being, as already suggested, are more luxury dwellings really a local priority? Given the choice between the ACV options and luxury apartments, I know where my vote would go if ever it came down to some, impartial, normal points of view.

But it doesn’t matter what I think. Nor does it matter what anyone else thinks reading this. And that’s where the big problem lies. It could be argued that there is not enough consideration for the thoughts of local residents and communities. But, stating the obvious, to the masses, there should be. The opinions of the local communities and residents should be of paramount importance. If it isn’t, then why isn’t it?

Who Else Misses The Ship Victory?

Let me go off on a bit of a tangent briefly. Above, I touched on the subject of another landmark pub being closed by the Council. Hands up, on that particular point, who in the local communities thought it was a good idea to close and demolish the historic and listed building status, The Ship Victory?

If you don’t remember the situation regarding The Ship Victory, have a read of this HERE.

Will the Council deprive our local communities of another popular, historic pub?

The Proposed New Development And The One Crucial Missing Word

The word luxury wasn’t missed out in the articles I read. But one crucial word was and it’s a word that should also be of paramount importance in the Council’s debating sessions I would have thought. And that word is affordable.

Nowhere in the sales pitch have I seen the word affordable. Maybe it’s not a major consideration in the Council’s housing strategy in 2021. It was however, in the 2014 to 2020 Housing Strategy report.

In the foreword, it said: “The aim of the Strategy is to address known issues in the local housing market and to ensure that all of the borough’s residents have the opportunity to access a safe, sustainable and affordable home.”

Slightly further on in the foreword, the affordable objective was re-iterated: “We also need to ensure that they are well-designed, of high quality, are affordable to local residents and meet local needs.” Note the extra bolded bit – i.e. “and meet local needs.”

Furthermore, the report did stress the need for new housing though: ” The delivery of housing in the borough, both affordable and market housing, has fallen behind household growth for a number of years. As a result, pressure on house prices in the borough has increased considerably, as demand for housing continues to outweigh supply and there is a significant shortage of affordable housing available to local people. First time buyers are effectively priced out of buying local homes, restricting movement throughout the rest of the market.”

Now there may well be a Housing Strategy for 2021 onwards that the public have not yet seen. Or, this report may well still be in the pipeline as the 2014 to 2020 report wasn’t published until November 2014, already eight months into the Council’s, then current year of, 2014/15.

Current Housing Strategy Report

The above are only snippets from the 2014 to 2020 Housing Strategy report. And, as I say, in the absence of a following strategy report from 2021 to ??, priorities may have changed?

But, even before it does appear, and considering the financial fallout from the pandemic, will there be a more likely need for affordable housing, or luxury apartments? Only time will tell I suppose. But if there was a greater need for affordable housing in Chester, there may be more suitable locations other than The Red House site, if there was ultimately a revised planning application in the offing.

Mind you, the affordable housing topic is not necessarily for this particular post, but a snippet of it has been used to illustrate the considerations presented in a decision between Option (a) and Option (b).

I would have thought that in the absence of a current Housing Strategy then the Council would postpone any decisions on luxury dwelling planning applications. Or, until it has been finalised, still rely on the important issues of the 2014 to 2020 report maybe?

That being the case, then it could be that the alternative Red House, ACV proposals will be well under way by then. In other words, The Red House ACV project ideas may well be gaining even more support and may have been developed even more in this passing of time, thereby offering even more facilities and opportunities to the local community.

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Let’s Save The Red House – Is It A Simple Choice Between (a) and (b)?

It will be interesting to see how the Council are going to approach this. As a lay person and a humble, non political, impartial local resident with no possible agendas to cloud my judgement, I would simply look at the virtues of a simple choice between (a) or (b). Will the Council view it this way? I guess they would, or should. If not, then why not? All will be revealed hopefully when they make their decisions.

Going off on another slight tangent, I wrote a post some months ago about the possibility of a local think tank. Or something similar of that ilk. If you didn’t read it (and if not, why not!!!!), you can have a peep at it in this link HERE.

Is something like this a good test case for a local think tank debate? Or at least a mini one between the Council, the appointed local residents involved in the The Red House proposals, other community groups in Huntington (e.g. the Village Hall) and the developers who submitted the planning application. Surely the final decision won’t just be announced without some sort of discussion?

On that note, watch this space.

All Those In Favour Of Option (a) Or Option (b)

As things stand, quite simply, who is in favour of Option (a) and who is in favour of Option (b)? It is worth noting that some people have already been making their opinions known. In case you didn’t know, there is a Facebook Group called, as expected – “Let’s Save The Red House.”

As I write this (30th March 2021), there are 659 members already in this almost three weeks old Group.

Here again is the link to the Group if you like to keep abreast of the latest news, or if you would like to lend your support.

Anyway, thanks for reading my latest (lengthy!!!) post – “Let’s Save The Red House.” Some food for thought in the post methinks.